Curse

Crystaldragonboy · Dec 02, 2005, 08:15 PM // 20:15

I didn't mean tangible in the real world, I meant for characters. In PvE you can get items and gold. That was what I was referring to as "tangible".

Sendai · Dec 02, 2005, 09:30 PM // 21:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

GUILDWARS IS NOT

NEVER HAS BEEN

NOR WILL BE

ADVERTISED AS BY ANET
SOLD AS BY ANET

AN MMORPG

IT COSTS LESS TO RUN BECAUSE IT IS NOT AN MMORPG

DID I MENTION IF YOU GO TO THE ANET GUILDWARS SITE THEY SAY IT IS NOT AN MMORPG?

WHY DO PEOPLE KEEP CALLING IT THAT WHEN THEY KEEP SAYING IT IS NOT AN MMORPG?

the fact that you have to login, to connect to a distant server, that there's no single player campaing or that you can't play if the Anet's server aren't online makes GuildWars basically works as a mmorpg. you can label it whatever you like but guildwars looks and smells like a mmorpg and they have basically the same costs to pay (server maintenance, bandwidth (even if their network code is uber optimized) etc.)

Concerning the GW business, if i was Anet, instead of directsong, i'd put the ability to purchase in-game gold (or may be nice looking items). It would at least help a little some casual gamers, and completly shutdown those advertising bots and those sweatshops like virg...

Mordakai · Dec 02, 2005, 10:14 PM // 22:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

IMO what the OP proves isn't that GW isn't profitable - I'd say it's already paid its development and the upkeep is miniscule in comparison - but that the "pay-to-play" model used by WoW and EQ2 is vastly MORE profitable than GW's "pay-to-enter" model.

WoW likely cost somewhat more to develop than GW, although probably less than double, and is definitely more costly to maintain, but:

* The cost to purchase of the games was the same (WoW has dropped in price now, to entice more people to join), and WoW outsold GW by a factor of 3-5. That is, the revenue from sales alone will have covered WoW's development and probably also maintenance cost for many years. It may even have been enough to completely cover the development costs of WoW2.

* The $15 each of the 1-2 million active WoW accounts pay PER MONTH, is pure profit. That is, every month WoW subscription fees alone return a profit comparable in size to the total profit from GW.

In short, it isn't so that WoW is just getting by covering its costs, and GW turning a loss, IMO the situation is that GW is turning a decent profit, but WoW has pure gold streaming out of every orifice.

However, comparing GW to WoW may be unfair.
WoW is a phenomenon, and one, I admit, I do not understand. The game is ugly, by all accounts it's a grind, the cost of playing for one year is in the region of $220, and yet it's a huge, massive, gigantonormous, runaway success. At least outside asia there is no MMORPG even remotely as successful as WoW.
Hence it might be more relevant to compare the profitability of GW to that of, say, Everquest2.

Unfortunately I have no idea how many units EQ2 has sold, or how many active accounts there are.

Awesome post, Numa.

For the money they are making, WoW should be better than SEX.

Phades · Dec 02, 2005, 10:18 PM // 22:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

simply stop playing the game. i think anyone that has played the game for any given amount of time would agree that you got more than $50 out of the game.

its not ment to be played ALL THE TIME. play it occasionally. play it at scheduled times with your guild.

if you are beating a dead horse its time to move on.

The game becomes the dead horse if people just stop playing it. New content doesn't mean new game mechanics. If the game is stale enough to stop entirely, there is no reason to come back as playing the game is the working of the game mechanics. Content is just what exists to use the mechanics with, not the other way around. Pvp is a near perfect example of that situation, as you have the mechanics in a near vaccume operating within a very finite area of content.

Its like saying to stop watching a tv sitcoms for awhile, because when new episodes come out you will like it more than you did when you first watched it. Its worse when you find yourself waiting for the inevitable punchline that is bound to happen ~20 minutes into the show every time. To stop watching (aka playing) is tantemount to just changing the channel or doing something else durring that timeslot. Time for a player is just as fininte as air time is for shows on TV and if something else comes along to arrest the attention of the individual, its not likely that they will go back to something they have already left behind.

Loviatar · Dec 02, 2005, 10:39 PM // 22:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phades

New content doesn't mean new game mechanics. . Content is just what exists to use the mechanics with, not the other way around. .

i on the other hand feel that if the game mechanics work why change them just for novelty?

to me CONTENT is the game and the game mechanics are simply there to access the content.

my opinion

Hot Dead · Dec 02, 2005, 11:02 PM // 23:02

NCSoft and ANet made GW
NCSoft made other games and is selling them, so thats where some of the money comes from
ANet worked with other companies besides NCSoft to make other games, thats also where some of the money comes from

NCSoft/ANet's money=60million from the 1.2million(give or take a few thousand) people playing GW+all the profits from their other games

When you think about it, ANet+NCSoft get just the right amount of money to continue the production of GW, server maintanence, updates, etc.

No need to feel bad for ANet, and saying that WoW & City of Heroes/Villians get more money than GW is totaly untrue, since they charge monthly you can play for one month non-stop and only spend about 16$ playing the game so its less than GW, but if everyone played yearly then yes, WOW,COH,COV make more money than GW

1337haXXor · Dec 03, 2005, 07:12 PM // 19:12

I agree with the poster 100% except on the paying monthly part. Everything he said is true. I think ANET needs to help out everybody, and quit alienating the established players. I understand the nerfing of the much overpowered natures renewal and increasing effects of certain skills for PvP. I hate however, that they destroy farming and running. It may help new players, but just pisses off everyboy else. There are many easy ways to get the equipment newbies need to play the game, such as weapon crafters. More people will buy the game if people like the game and suggest it to their friends. Thers a difference between balancing things and destroying them that anet doesnt realize.

master_ranger_matt · Dec 03, 2005, 07:16 PM // 19:16

no one will buy the game if customer support sucks...
you're also saying $50 a game profit, this is totally unrealistic; if they got all the money from the cost of the game the stores would be losing money (and shelf space) by selling it

Loviatar · Dec 03, 2005, 07:20 PM // 19:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1337haXXor

I Thers a difference between balancing things and destroying them that anet doesnt realize.

and the quote below is from the great nerfing scream by the farmers that Anet ruined not just farming but the whole game and real life as well.

and a good chunk of those 50 were good superiors

Quote:

Riverside was obviously the most well known and the one I hit first. I was one of the lucky ones that made it there in time to get ahead of the game.. I understand why they nerfed those giants since you could get like 50 runes an hour if you knew what you were doing... But since then I have bounced from farming spot to farming spot only to have them closed within a couple of days at best.